Pope reverts to type

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Pope reverts to type

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:13 am

Still the world's biggest child rape conspiracy.

Pope shocks Chile by accusing sex abuse victims of slander (AP)
SANTIAGO, Chile (AP) — Pope Francis accused victims of Chile’s most notorious pedophile of slander Thursday, an astonishing end to a visit meant to help heal the wounds of a sex abuse scandal that has cost the Catholic Church its credibility in the country.

Francis said that until he sees proof that Bishop Juan Barros was complicit in covering up the sex crimes of the Rev. Fernando Karadimas, such accusations against Barros are “all calumny.”

The pope’s remarks drew shock from Chileans and immediate rebuke from victims and their advocates. They noted the accusers were deemed credible enough by the Vatican that it sentenced Karadima to a lifetime of “penance and prayer” for his crimes in 2011. A Chilean judge also found the victims to be credible, saying that while she had to drop criminal charges against Karadima because too much time had passed, proof of his crimes wasn’t lacking.

...
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Anaxagoras » Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:24 am

What kind of sentence is "a lifetime of penance and prayer" for a Catholic priest?

Like sentencing Ed to a lifetime of cleaning and restoring old guns.
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Witness » Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:56 am

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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Grammatron » Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:22 am

No surprise.

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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Anaxagoras » Thu Apr 12, 2018 2:40 am

Pope says he was misled.

Pope admits ‘serious errors’ on Chilean bishop accused of cover up
Pope Francis acknowledged that he has made “serious errors of assessment and perception” in the case of Chilean Bishop Juan Barros Madrid, who has been accused of covering up for a pedophile priest and whom the pontiff has repeatedly defended.

“I recognize and I want you to communicate this accurately, that I have made serious errors of judgement and perception of the situation, especially due to lack of truthful and balanced information,” Francis wrote in a letter to the Chilean bishops.

In the following weeks, Francis will meet in Rome with some victims of clerical sexual abuse from Chile and individually ask them for their forgiveness, according to the spokesman for the Chilean bishops’ conference.

Ahead of those meetings, announced by spokesman Jaime Coiro via Twitter as the letter was being read out in Chile, Francis said that “from this moment, I apologize to all those whom I offended and I hope to be able to do it personally, in the coming weeks, in the meetings that I will have with representatives of the people interviewed.”

In addition, the 32 Chilean bishops who make up the conference will be travelling to Rome in the third week of May, summoned by Francis in the letter. During this meeting, the pontiff will share with them the conclusions he has reached after reading a report presented to him by Archbishop Charles J. Scicluna of Malta.

“I plan to call you to Rome to discuss the conclusions of the aforementioned visit and my conclusions,” Francis said, announcing what will be the biggest gathering of bishops to discuss clerical sex abuse in response to a papal summons.
Francis sent Scicluna, the Vatican’s former top prosecutor for sex abuse crimes in the Church under Pope emeritus Benedict XVI, to listen to those who have “manifested their will to make known elements they possess” against Barros, appointed by the Argentine pontiff in 2015 to the Diocese of Osorno.

Scicluna’s most celebrated prosecution involved the late Mexican Father Marcial Maciel Degollado, founder of the Legion of Christ, who was found guilty in 2006 and sentenced to a life of “prayer and penance.”

Scicluna and his colleague, Father Jordi Bertomeu, spent nearly two weeks in Chile and New York earlier this year interviewing Father Fernando Karadima’s victims, who for years have denounced Barros’ denials that he witnessed Karadima’s abuse. The two presented their findings to the pope in a 2,300 page report on March 20.
It's not entirely clear though, is it. Seems that although he apologized, it's still a bit vague exactly what he apologized for and he stopped short of saying that Bishop Barros was involved in a cover-up.
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by sparks » Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:48 am

As Gods personal rep on Earth, he's supposed to be infallible. How can he have been misled? :o
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Thu Apr 12, 2018 4:49 am

sparks wrote:As Gods personal rep on Earth, he's supposed to be infallible. How can he have been misled? :o
The doctrine papal infallibility does not apply in a case like this.

Explanation by moi over by Shermerland.
The Pope is considered infallible only when he makes statements ex cathedra concerning faith or morals.

Those would become irrevocable Catholic doctrines on the order of the stuff derived from the Bible. No mere matters of policy, even long standing ones such as priestly celibacy, or the aforementioned rescinded meatless Friday.

Popes have used this "power" very sparingly, often in response to new conditions not obviously covered by existing doctrine.

Example: The prohibition on birth control pills. Non-obvious because unlike previous birth control methods, there is no spilling of seed.

Example: The assumption of Mary. A folk doctrine explicitly made an essential doctrine of the Church.

Example: Papal infallibility. Really. Image

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papal_infallibility
http://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.p ... 71#p121471
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Thu Apr 12, 2018 4:54 am

Bear on mind the Pope wears several hats.

He is the Vicar of Christ, but also prince of the Papal States (which at present is a few square meters in Rome), the administrative head of the Roman Catholic church organization, etc.

Only infallible when officially playing Jesus, which is only occasionally.
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by ed » Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:10 am

Abdul Alhazred wrote:Bear on mind the Pope wears several hats.

He is the Vicar of Christ, but also prince of the Papal States (which at present is a few square meters yards in Rome), the administrative head of the Roman Catholic church organization, etc.

Only infallible when officially playing Jesus, which is only occasionally.
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Witness » Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:18 am

Abdul Alhazred wrote:The doctrine papal infallibility does not apply in a case like this.
I've seen this used by self-proclaimed Catholics when they cherry-pick the Doctrine, avoiding the points they deem unpleasant: "He's not infallible outside of… blah, blah…".

Heretics, all of them! :x

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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:59 am

ed wrote:
Abdul Alhazred wrote:Bear on mind the Pope wears several hats.

He is the Vicar of Christ, but also prince of the Papal States (which at present is a few square meters yards in Rome), the administrative head of the Roman Catholic church organization, etc.

Only infallible when officially playing Jesus, which is only occasionally.
FIFY. This is America, in case you forgot. :x :x :x
You mean America, where everybody gets to play Jesus? :mrgreen:
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Thu Apr 12, 2018 12:02 pm

Witness wrote:
Abdul Alhazred wrote:The doctrine papal infallibility does not apply in a case like this.
I've seen this used by self-proclaimed Catholics when they cherry-pick the Doctrine, avoiding the points they deem unpleasant: "He's not infallible outside of… blah, blah…".

Heretics, all of them! :x
Maybe so, but it really is an important distinction.

In effect, the Pope is held to be infallible only when he officially announces he's about to be infallible. At which point what is proclaimed becomes eternal doctrine.

Which is not done often for obvious reasons.
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by ed » Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:49 pm

Even gods representative on earth need the occasional out.
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Re: Pope reverts to type

Post by Witness » Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:35 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:Maybe so, but it really is an important distinction.

In effect, the Pope is held to be infallible only when he officially announces he's about to be infallible. At which point what is proclaimed becomes eternal doctrine.
Sure, every time I say so, everything I tell you about my imaginary friend is True© because I'm Inspired© (and you better remember it, or else…).

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