Immigration and the nature of our society

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ed
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Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by ed » Mon Jan 29, 2018 12:13 pm

I heard an interview on Tucker the other day. Some chick taking the side that Trumps immigration plan was racist. The nubbin of the argument, I think, is that the plan precludes chain migration thus reducing the number of people of color ergo, racist.

This leaves me with a question. Is our population to be viewed in the same way as a work force? That is to say, are we supposed to strive for "diversity" of that group of people independent of the best interest of citizens?

Put another way, should our culture, which is rooted in humanistic, post reformation, europe be forced to change for the requirements of current PC demands?
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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Mon Jan 29, 2018 3:41 pm

FWIW, Trump's alleged "plan" as far as I can see involves no additional legislation.

Merely an enforcement of existing law.

Am I missing something?
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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Rob Lister » Mon Jan 29, 2018 5:27 pm

ed wrote:I heard an interview on Tucker the other day. Some chick taking the side that Trumps immigration plan was racist. The nubbin of the argument, I think, is that the plan precludes chain migration thus reducing the number of people of color ergo, racist.

This leaves me with a question. Is our population to be viewed in the same way as a work force? That is to say, are we supposed to strive for "diversity" of that group of people independent of the best interest of citizens?

Put another way, should our culture, which is rooted in humanistic, post reformation, europe be forced to change for the requirements of current PC demands?
Great post.

We should each work and vote to our own best interests. Really that's it.

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Mentat » Mon Jan 29, 2018 5:35 pm

Yeah, some want to shut out trade and immigration because they just can't compete with most of the world, and that's how they want to vote. Some want the best bang for their buck when it comes to spending on goods, services, and labor, and they vote otherwise. Same old same old.
It's "pea-can", man.

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Anaxagoras » Mon Jan 29, 2018 5:38 pm

"We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal."
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Doctor X » Mon Jan 29, 2018 5:40 pm

"Some are more equal than others," Anax.

You do believe Napoleon is always right, yes?

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Anaxagoras » Mon Jan 29, 2018 5:44 pm

Napoleon Dynamite, sure!
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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by gnome » Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:10 pm

ed wrote: Put another way, should our culture, which is rooted in humanistic, post reformation, europe be forced to change for the requirements of current PC demands?
One could just as easily ask if our culture should be forced to stay the same for someone's demands?

That's kind of a troll response though on my part. In actuality I agree with an immigration policy that favors assimilation, and I think there is room for a valuable compromise that lands somewhere between strict nativism and uncontrolled open borders. Now if we could just get our politicians off those extremes...
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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Doctor X » Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:27 pm

I generally agree with "assimilation" that diminishes treating women as chattel and promotes the use of soap.

--J.D.
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"Doctor X is just treating you the way he treats everyone--as subhuman crap too dumb to breathe in after you breathe out."--Don
DocX: FTW.--sparks
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"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
"I'd leave it up to Doctor X who has been a benevolent tyrant so far."--Grammatron
"Indeed you are a river to your people.
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"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by WildCat » Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:59 pm

Mentat wrote:Yeah, some want to shut out trade and immigration because they just can't compete with most of the world, and that's how they want to vote. Some want the best bang for their buck when it comes to spending on goods, services, and labor, and they vote otherwise. Same old same old.
I'll go with that when the same rules apply to government workers. For example, when school districts hire teachers from India who are willing to do the job for $25K/yr with no benefits.

Deal?
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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Mentat » Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:03 pm

WildCat wrote:
Mentat wrote:Yeah, some want to shut out trade and immigration because they just can't compete with most of the world, and that's how they want to vote. Some want the best bang for their buck when it comes to spending on goods, services, and labor, and they vote otherwise. Same old same old.
I'll go with that when the same rules apply to government workers. For example, when school districts hire teachers from India who are willing to do the job for $25K/yr with no benefits.

Deal?
As long as they're good at their job and it doesn't involve national security, sure thing.
It's "pea-can", man.

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:05 pm

One more data point.

Worried about Trump-stoked exodus of immigrants, Canada discourages illegal crossings
LA Times

I guess we aren't sending our best? :BigGrin3:
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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Grammatron » Mon Jan 29, 2018 8:03 pm

Rob Lister wrote: Great post.

We should each work and vote to our own best interests. Really that's it.
The trouble does seem to start with good intentions.

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by WildCat » Mon Jan 29, 2018 8:41 pm

Mentat wrote:
WildCat wrote:
Mentat wrote:Yeah, some want to shut out trade and immigration because they just can't compete with most of the world, and that's how they want to vote. Some want the best bang for their buck when it comes to spending on goods, services, and labor, and they vote otherwise. Same old same old.
I'll go with that when the same rules apply to government workers. For example, when school districts hire teachers from India who are willing to do the job for $25K/yr with no benefits.

Deal?
As long as they're good at their job and it doesn't involve national security, sure thing.
When it happens I'll support importing private sector workers solely because they're willing to work cheap.
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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Witness » Tue Jan 30, 2018 5:12 am

WildCat wrote:When it happens I'll support importing private sector workers solely because they're willing to work cheap.
Depends on the meaning of "importing": the airport here had Polish workers come in trailers, with their own food, insurance and of course also Polish wages.

The local workforce wasn't very happy.

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by WildCat » Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:21 am

Witness wrote:
WildCat wrote:When it happens I'll support importing private sector workers solely because they're willing to work cheap.
Depends on the meaning of "importing": the airport here had Polish workers come in trailers, with their own food, insurance and of course also Polish wages.

The local workforce wasn't very happy.
Would you rather they move the French airport to Poland?
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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by Doctor X » Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:29 am

The French surrendering to Poland?

Image

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"Indeed you are a river to your people.
Shit. That's going to end up in your sig."--Pyrrho
"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by ed » Tue Jan 30, 2018 12:18 pm

Doctor X wrote:The French surrendering to Poland?

Image

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by sparks » Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:07 pm

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Re: Immigration and the nature of our society

Post by ed » Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:17 pm

gnome wrote:
ed wrote: Put another way, should our culture, which is rooted in humanistic, post reformation, europe be forced to change for the requirements of current PC demands?
One could just as easily ask if our culture should be forced to stay the same for someone's demands?

That's kind of a troll response though on my part. In actuality I agree with an immigration policy that favors assimilation, and I think there is room for a valuable compromise that lands somewhere between strict nativism and uncontrolled open borders. Now if we could just get our politicians off those extremes...
Of course. But generally one who is promoting change is the one who has to make the case, no?
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