California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

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Re: California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

Post by Doctor X » Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:49 am

Clearly none of you support epi-gendered undocumented members on corporate boards.




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Re: California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

Post by Anaxagoras » Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:50 am

But clearly religious toleration does not mean "always side with the Muslim".

My issue here is not that liberals are by definition in favor of religious toleration, but that as you wrote originally "anyone who does not side with Muslims is Islamophobic." Religious toleration is neutral. "Always side with Muslims" clearly favors one particular religion over others.
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Re: California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

Post by Doctor X » Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:13 am

You know, Anax, that many areas of the United States are under the Sharia Law. . . .

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Re: California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

Post by xouper » Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:52 am

Anaxagoras wrote:
Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:50 am
But clearly religious toleration does not mean "always side with the Muslim".

My issue here is not that liberals are by definition in favor of religious toleration, but that as you wrote originally "anyone who does not side with Muslims is Islamophobic." Religious toleration is neutral. "Always side with Muslims" clearly favors one particular religion over others.
You make a good point.

However, my original statement — the one you asked me to provide evidence for — was this:
xouper wrote:
Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:17 am
And by definition, liberals are not Islamophobic.
Anaxagoras wrote:
Tue Oct 02, 2018 1:42 am
Where did you find this definition of the word liberal? I'd like to see it.
I think it is fair to say that if a person is tolerant of Islam, then they are by definition not Islamophobic.

Is that not what you asked me to show?

Secondly, you quoted me out of context. It was not my claim that "anyone who does not side with Muslims is Islamophobic."

Here's my original quote:
xouper wrote:
Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:59 am
According to (some undefined subset of) liberals, anyone who does not side with Muslims is Islamophobic.
I was attributing that claim to someone else. You suggested that was a straw man. Maybe so, maybe not.

For you personally, I will accept your assertion that you do not make that claim. I will even accept your assertion that many liberals do not make that claim.

However, I am not yet convinced that all (or even most) liberals believe as you do. So while I have not sufficiently supported my claim, neither has it been refuted. Stalemate?

Nor does it undermine my other claim that liberals are by definition not Islamophobic. And even if you can show me a rare liberal who is Islamophobic, I would say that person is the exception that proves the rule.

Thirdly, in the court case I cited, I was not saying that liberals side with Muslims over other religions (although in fact I think they do indeed favor Islam over Christianity or Judaism), I was suggesting that liberals will side with Muslims over LGBTQ, as in the court case I cited. And while I have not justified that claim, I will say it is merely my personal observation, which may (or not) be accurate.

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Re: California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

Post by Anaxagoras » Tue Oct 02, 2018 7:07 am

It is for the one making the claim to support it, not for others to refute it when no evidence has been offered.

"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence." -- Hitchens' razor

To clarify, I'll accept that the definition of "liberal" implies a belief in religious tolerance. What I question is that "liberals" say that "anyone who does not side with Muslims is Islamophobic". When you used the term "Islamophobic" after defining it thusly, that's what I intended to take issue with.

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Re: California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

Post by xouper » Tue Oct 02, 2018 7:31 am

Anaxagoras wrote:
Tue Oct 02, 2018 7:07 am
It is for the one making the claim to support it, not for others to refute it when no evidence has been offered.

"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence." -- Hitchens' razor
Except I gave evidences for my claim.

Anaxagoras wrote:
Tue Oct 02, 2018 7:07 am
To clarify, I'll accept that the definition of "liberal" implies a belief in religious tolerance.
Thank you. See, we don't always disagree. :)

Anaxagoras wrote:
Tue Oct 02, 2018 7:07 am
What I question is that "liberals" say that "anyone who does not side with Muslims is Islamophobic". When you used the term "Islamophobic" after defining it thusly, that's what I intended to take issue with.
I did not intend that claim to be a redefinition of Islamophobia. I assumed you already knew the definition.

As for my claim that "According to (some undefined subset of) liberals, anyone who does not side with Muslims is Islamophobic" I will concede I have not justified it. It is based on my observations of certain liberals in the media accusing critics of Islam of being Islamophobic. You are free to dismiss that observation, I don't really care. I know what I've seen, and it is not important to me whether you believe me.

In any case, if you are claiming the opposite (that no liberal has ever made that particular claim), then the burden of evidences suddenly shifts to the person making the new claim, which is you.

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Re: California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 02, 2018 8:41 am

gnome thinks there are politicians who are nice like him.

No. :)
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Re: California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

Post by Anaxagoras » Fri Oct 05, 2018 12:28 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:
Tue Oct 02, 2018 8:41 am
gnome thinks there are politicians who are nice like him.

No. :)
That seems cynical.
I think the nature of politics may force even people who come into it with the best of intentions to make compromises.

What about Jimmy Carter? Wasn't he basically a nice guy? Or if not Carter, Reagan? Although I know lots of people from opposite sides of politics hated Carter and Reagan because they hated their political agendas, to the best of my recollection nobody ever said that they were assholes in person.
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Re: California becomes first state to require a woman on corporate boards

Post by Doctor X » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:40 pm

Have you ever talked to Mr. Peanut?

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