Monster waves

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ed
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Post by ed »

98% of rogue waves occur out of sight of humans and of those observed by humans only the smallest waves (lowest 45%) are reported inasmuch as no observers survive encounters with the largest ones.
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Post by robinson »

According to the BBC documentary, freak waves are so common they shouldn't be called freak waves anymore.

Until something else happened .... involving the Caledonian Star ...
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Post by En folkefiende »

ed wrote:98% of rogue waves occur out of sight of humans and of those observed by humans only the smallest waves (lowest 45%) are reported inasmuch as no observers survive encounters with the largest ones.
That is the difficulty with such things.
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Post by robinson »

ed wrote:98% of rogue waves occur out of sight of humans and of those observed by humans only the smallest waves (lowest 45%) are reported inasmuch as no observers survive encounters with the largest ones.
You really do like making up statistics!
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Post by ed »

Yes, I do.

And I do it well.

I do it with .... Impunity.

About 98.5% of the time.
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Post by En folkefiende »

ed wrote:Yes, I do.

And I do it well.

I do it with .... Impunity.

About 98.5% of the time.
Well, if you consider how much of the open ocean humans are watching to that degree of accuracy, it doesn't sound like such a bad estimate.
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Post by ed »

jj wrote:
ed wrote:Yes, I do.

And I do it well.

I do it with .... Impunity.

About 98.5% of the time.
Well, if you consider how much of the open ocean humans are watching to that degree of accuracy, it doesn't sound like such a bad estimate.
Actually, I stole the notion from Sebastian Junger's book. I made up the stats with an eye toward truthyness.

Voila!!!

An apparent fact!!!

Internet style. :D
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Post by EvilYeti »

robinson wrote:Found the BBC documentary on this.
- Part 1, links to the other parts from there

Ed, I wouldn't watch this, it will give you nightmares

Yeti, you shouldn't watch either. It makes you look dumb. Or was that jj?

Cool video of a rogue wave breaking over an aircraft carrier
I emailed one of my contacts that works with the pacific tsunami warning center.

They have sensors all over the pacific basin.

No evidence of rogue waves to date.

So, apparently, you are completely full of shit.

Which is to be expected, of course. Nice try, though.
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Post by DrMatt »

But did the wave sing Wubba Wubba Wubba Doodly Doo?

Using seismic sensors to measure wave height is like using a pot roast thermometer to measure wind speed. Yeah, you can probably do it, but it's not the most efficent and accurate tool for the job at hand.
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Post by robinson »



Interesting video. The wave passed from stern to bow, and they got video of it as it was moving away from them. You can see at one point the triangular shape of the peak. Even from the back it is awesome.

From that video I can see how if the triangular looking peak was to hit a ship, it would be just like sailors always said, a wall of water, with a huge hole in front of it.

And it is breaking, unlike a normal deep ocean swell.

It looks like two of them, the second one peaks almost right in front of the bow. You can see the size of the normal waves, by comparison very small.
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Post by EvilYeti »

DrMatt wrote:
Using seismic sensors to measure wave height is like using a pot roast thermometer to measure wind speed. Yeah, you can probably do it, but it's not the most efficent and accurate tool for the job at hand.
Which is why they don't use seismic sensors.

Image
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Post by Geni »

robinson wrote:

Interesting video. The wave passed from stern to bow, and they got video of it as it was moving away from them. You can see at one point the triangular shape of the peak. Even from the back it is awesome.
Nope nowhere near freak wave size.
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Post by EvilYeti »

Geni wrote:
robinson wrote:

Interesting video. The wave passed from stern to bow, and they got video of it as it was moving away from them. You can see at one point the triangular shape of the peak. Even from the back it is awesome.
Nope nowhere near freak wave size.
Yup. So far he's posted nothing but videos of big waves.

And apparently, big waves do exist. Despite the apparent skepticism of the evil scientists.
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Post by robinson »

robinson wrote:

My favorite, clip stops when water smashes through the bridge windows
After watching the BBC show, that clip is actually stolen from the show, not a real video. A recreation for the BBC documentary.

Obviously the trolls here didn't watch the clips, evidenced by their stupid claims that nothing but big waves have been shown on the YouTube links.

That recreation was of a 30 meter wave that almost destroyed the ship, smashing all controls, stopping the engines and causing the liner to almost sink.

But keep up your stupid commentary, it brings many lulz.
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Post by EvilYeti »

robinson wrote: Obviously the trolls here didn't watch the clips, evidenced by their stupid claims that nothing but big waves have been shown on the YouTube links.
Rogue waves, also known as freak waves, monster waves or extreme waves, are relatively large and spontaneous ocean surface waves that are a threat even to large ships and ocean liners. In oceanography, they are more precisely defined as waves whose height is more than twice the significant wave height (SWH), which is itself defined as the mean of the largest third of waves in a wave record. Therefore rogue waves are not necessarily the biggest waves found at sea; they are, rather, surprisingly large waves for a given sea state.
Were any of the waves in the videos more than twice the significant wave height during the period of their observation?

If not, wouldn't that make you the troll?

Edit: I just saw the Deadliest Catch clip. That's the only one that looks legit to me.
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Post by robinson »

3 Men Watching Surf Drown in Rogue Wave Along California Coast

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,458647,00.html
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Post by Mentat »

How does a wave break out at sea?
It's "pea-can", man.

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Post by robinson »

Mentat wrote:How does a wave break out at sea?
They don't seem to "break" like a wave onshore, where the energy is turned into heat and mechanical energy, but at some point the wave face is so high the front of the wave is white from foam, as water falls down the face of the wave.

In other news
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... M&refer=us

Boothbay Harbor, Maine, gets hammered. Fortune has it that monitoring stations showed evidence of the waves, which makes it hard for "skeptics" to deny it happened. The twisted inch-thick steel pins and destroyed boat ramps also is considered evidence of freak waves coming ashore there. (You can't go by the hundreds of eye witnesses who actually saw the event, because people lie about this stuff).
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Post by EvilYeti »

robinson wrote:
Boothbay Harbor, Maine, gets hammered. Fortune has it that monitoring stations showed evidence of the waves, which makes it hard for "skeptics" to deny it happened.
Breaking news... skeptics prove rouge waves exist...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draupner_wave

...in 1995.
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Re: Monster waves

Post by Anaxagoras »

A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare
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Re: Monster waves

Post by ed »

Makes me think of the Edmund Fitzgerald.
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Post by ed »

robinson wrote: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:14 pm

Considering that until 1995 "scientist" refused to believe in Freak waves at all, I don't listen to skeptics when they dismiss stuff they know nothing about.

Thousands of years of actual sailors, you know, people who actually sailed around on the ocean, for thousands of years they told about freak waves, and the terrible losses from them. Scientist refused to believe. They didn't just dismiss the entire history of eye witness accounts of them, they refused to believe it could even happen. It was a myth.


:D
Hmmmm ... makes me think of sea serpents.
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Re: Monster waves

Post by robinson »

Or how pilots refused to refuse to fly over thunderstorms. They claimed there was trouble, even miles about the convection and lightning.
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Re: Monster waves

Post by ed »

Image

I have thought that there was something to the idea. Particularly now, today. After all, we humans probably cover far less of the ocean than we did in the 19th or 18th century, don't you think? We have well established sea lanes, vast areas never see a ship. Creatures could exist unseen and unremarked.
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Post by The Atheist »

I've only just seen this thread and it's an area of interest to me, so I'll start here, even though the post is years old.
EvilYeti wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:31 am No evidence of rogue waves to date.
23.8m, which is 78 feet. I think that firmly hits the mark for freak wave.

https://www.metocean.co.nz/news/2018/5/ ... hern-ocean
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Re: Monster waves

Post by robinson2 »

For your information and edification the Evil Yeti has not been seen since October 2017
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Post by Rob Lister »

robinson wrote: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:14 pm YouTube has multiple videos of Freak Waves hitting ships, even one of an offshore break.

<big wave videos>
There are more. Some argue that they are not Freak waves, just big waves.
What constitutes a "freak wave" I've been major hurricanes on aircraft carriers and I've seen green water far over the flight deck (~70ft) on more than a couple of occasions. Not really fair to call them waves; Rather, swell is the correct term. I think the largest swell/trough measured was about 95 ft.
Robin's bastard son wrote: Considering that until 1995 "scientist" refused to believe in Freak waves at all
What is that scientist's name? Put it here ________
Then I'll say, "So?"
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Re: Monster waves

Post by robinson »

Exactly!
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Re: Monster waves

Post by Rob Lister »

I think you're like that skeptic you refuse to listen to. You might actually be that skeptic you refuse to listen to.
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Re: Monster waves

Post by robinson2 »

Don't feed the troll Rob
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Re: Monster waves

Post by robinson »

Shut the hell up you bot
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Post by The Atheist »

robinson2 wrote: Mon Jul 13, 2020 8:36 pm For your information and edification the Evil Yeti has not been seen since October 2017
I figured, but it seemed like a good place to join the thread.

I've always been amused by skepticism around rogue waves. Oddly, the skeptics are all people to whom I'd usually use the highly technical sailing terms of "sharp end" and "blunt end" to make sure they know where things are.
Rob Lister wrote: Mon Jul 13, 2020 8:51 pm What constitutes a "freak wave" I've been major hurricanes on aircraft carriers and I've seen green water far over the flight deck (~70ft) on more than a couple of occasions. Not really fair to call them waves; Rather, swell is the correct term. I think the largest swell/trough measured was about 95 ft.
Now, that's funny*.

Probably about the same time this thread started, JREF had one, started by some skeptic with no brain who was denying the existence of rogue waves. (rouge waves,** I doubt)

I even posted a copy of a newspaper from 1943 where a correspondent was invited to join an Arctic convoy and was on the bridge of an aircraft carrier and witnessed one that even made the captain shit himself, being almost as high as the bridge, and at least 80 feet tall.

My old man was a carrier bloke in the Royal Navy. Joined pre-war and was a CPO through the entire WWII, serving on those awful converted merchant carriers as well as brand new ones, like HMS Formidable, where he was decorated for operations in a kamikaze attack.

* One of the few blokes here I don't class as a wanker is a carrier guy... Hmmm. Probably something in the av gas.

**
EvilYeti wrote: Fri Nov 28, 2008 7:59 pm... rouge waves ...
Jeff Wagg, Communication and Outreach Manager for the James Randi Educational Foundation posted:

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Re: Monster waves

Post by ed »

Didn't Halsey loose 4 or 5 ships in a storm? Navy ships? Big fuckers.
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Re: Monster waves

Post by The Atheist »

ed wrote: Mon Jul 13, 2020 9:42 pm Didn't Halsey loose 4 or 5 ships in a storm?
Dunno, but I'd go down on her in a heartbeat.
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Re: Monster waves

Post by ed »

Typhoon Cobra, also known as the Typhoon of 1944 or Halsey's Typhoon (named after Admiral William 'Bull' Halsey), was the United States Navy designation for a powerful tropical cyclone that struck the United States Pacific Fleet in December 1944, during World War II.

Task Force 38 (TF 38) had been operating about 300 mi (260 nmi; 480 km) east of Luzon in the Philippine Sea, conducting air raids against Japanese airfields in the Philippines. The fleet was attempting to refuel its ships, in particular the lighter destroyers, which had small fuel tanks. As the weather worsened, refueling became increasingly difficult, and the attempts had to be discontinued. Despite warning signs of worsening conditions, the ships remained on station. Worse, the information given to Halsey about the location and direction of the typhoon was inaccurate. On December 17, Halsey unwittingly sailed the Third Fleet into the center of the typhoon.

Because of 100 mph (87 kn; 45 m/s; 160 km/h) winds, high seas, and torrential rain, three destroyers capsized and sank, with 790 lives lost. Nine other warships were damaged, and over 100 aircraft were wrecked or washed overboard. The aircraft carrier Monterey was forced to battle a serious fire that was caused by a plane hitting a bulkhead.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Typhoon_Cobra
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Re: Monster waves

Post by Witness »

When I was in Aran (not Arran) locals told me that people fishing from one of their cliffs had once been carried away by a rogue wave. I couldn't find this specific event but got a source for similar stuff happening around Ireland:
Extreme wave events in Ireland: 2012–2016

Abstract
This paper aims to extend and update the survey of extreme wave events in Ireland that was previously carried out by O'Brien et al. (2013). The original catalogue highlighted the frequency of such events dating back as far as the turn of the last ice age through to 2012. Ireland's marine territory extends far beyond its coastline and is one of the largest seabed territories in Europe. It is therefore not surprising that extreme waves have continued to occur regularly since 2012, particularly considering the severity of weather during the winters of 2013–14 and 2015–16. In addition, a large number of storm surges have been identified since the publication of the original catalogue. This paper updates the O'Brien et al. (2013) catalogue to include events up to the end of 2016. Storm surges are included as a new category and events are categorised into long waves (tsunamis and storm surges) and short waves (storm and rogue waves). New results prior to 2012 are also included and some of the events previously documented are reclassified. Important questions regarding public safety, services and the influence of climate change are also highlighted.
https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... _2012-2016

Downloadable PDF at the link.

Remember: sea waves travel slower when the depth is small. That's why they break. And also why an innocuous swell in mid-ocean can become a wall of water when coming near the shore.