Fukushima one year on

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robinson
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by robinson » Fri Sep 06, 2019 4:02 pm

Ah, the good old no TrueTM SkepticTM fallacy!
You never know what's going to happen, then some shit happens nobody saw coming, then later somebody says they knew it was coming, then some new shit happens nobody saw coming, rinse and repeat

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robinson
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by robinson » Fri Sep 06, 2019 4:02 pm

No true skeptic would call me a bot
You never know what's going to happen, then some shit happens nobody saw coming, then later somebody says they knew it was coming, then some new shit happens nobody saw coming, rinse and repeat

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robinson
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by robinson » Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:07 am

You twit
You never know what's going to happen, then some shit happens nobody saw coming, then later somebody says they knew it was coming, then some new shit happens nobody saw coming, rinse and repeat

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robinson
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by robinson » Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:10 am

robinson wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 1:04 pm
The Internet can make you cranky
sparks wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 9:39 pm
Can?
Yes, it can. The trick is, or rather the secret of it all, is to not look at internet
You never know what's going to happen, then some shit happens nobody saw coming, then later somebody says they knew it was coming, then some new shit happens nobody saw coming, rinse and repeat

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Witness
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by Witness » Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:38 pm

Fukushima: Japan will have to dump radioactive water into Pacific, minister says

More than a million tonnes of contaminated water lies in storage but power company says it will run out of space by 2022

The operator of the ruined Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant will have to dump huge quantities of contaminated water from the site directly into the Pacific Ocean, Japan’s environment minister has said – a move that would enrage local fishermen.

More than 1 million tonnes of contaminated water has accumulated at the plant since it was struck by a tsunami in March 2011, triggering a triple meltdown that forced the evacuation of tens of thousands of residents.

Tokyo Electric Power (Tepco) has struggled to deal with the buildup of groundwater, which becomes contaminated when it mixes with water used to prevent the three damaged reactor cores from melting.

Tepco has attempted to remove most radionuclides from the excess water, but the technology does not exist to rid the water of tritium, a radioactive isotope of hydrogen. Coastal nuclear plants commonly dump water that contains tritium into the ocean. It occurs in minute amounts in nature.

Tepco admitted last year that the water in its tanks still contained contaminants beside tritium.

Currently, more than 1m tonnes of contaminated water is held in almost 1,000 tanks at the Fukushima Daiichi site, but the utility has warned that it will run out of tank space by the summer of 2022.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... ister-says

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sparks
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by sparks » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:49 pm

You'd think that after 8 years of cooling of what's left of the 3 cores that they'd be stable enough not to need cooling.

https://www.ucsusa.org/nuclear-power/nu ... spent-fuel

"All spent fuel should be transferred from wet to dry storage within five years of discharge from the reactor core. "

The Fukushima meltdowns are hardly a normal situation I grant you, but 8 years of water is still 8 years. Why are Tepco peeps worried about running out of places to put contaminated water in '22? What's going on that they still need to dump water on these fucking slag heaps at all?
You can lead them to knowledge, but you can't make them think.

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robinson
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by robinson » Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:17 pm

That is the terrible dark secret. The same one is happening at Chernobyl
You never know what's going to happen, then some shit happens nobody saw coming, then later somebody says they knew it was coming, then some new shit happens nobody saw coming, rinse and repeat

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ceptimus
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by ceptimus » Sat Oct 19, 2019 12:01 am

I suppose the spent fuel is in rods with a high surface to volume ratio for good passive cooling, whereas the ex-core is in larger clumps that therefore require more cooling to stop them melting?

Same reason an elephant has trouble keeping cool while a mouse in the same environment has trouble keeping warm - even with its fur coat.

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Witness
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by Witness » Sat Oct 19, 2019 12:17 am

↑ Good point. And there's also the fact that a hefty "clump" will be nearer the critical mass… and generating more energy than broken up in separate rods.

For a sphere of plutonium it's ~ 10 kg.

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Witness
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by Witness » Sat Oct 19, 2019 12:21 am

2,667 radioactive bags from Fukushima nuke disaster unleashed by Typhoon Hagibis

According to Asahi Shimbun, a temporary storage facility containing some 2,667 bags stuffed with radioactive contaminants from the 2011 Fukushima Daiichi nuclear disaster was unexpectedly inundated by floodwaters brought by Typhoon Hagibis. Torrential rain flooded the storage facility and released the bags into a stream 100 meters away.

Officials from Tamara City in Fukushima Prefecture said that each bag is approximately one cubic meter in size. Authorities were only able to recover six of the bags by 9 p.m. on Oct. 12, and it is uncertain how many remain on the loose while the possible environmental impact is being assessed.
https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3795303

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sparks
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by sparks » Sat Oct 19, 2019 2:49 am

Oops.
You can lead them to knowledge, but you can't make them think.

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Fid
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by Fid » Sat Oct 19, 2019 5:01 am

Wow the disaster that keeps on disasting.
"Try SCE to AUX."
Yeah, me and an electrified atmosphere ain't friends.

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Witness
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by Witness » Sat Oct 19, 2019 11:06 pm

Japan needs thousands of foreign workers to decommission Fukushima plant, prompting backlash from anti-nuke campaigners and rights activists
  • Activists are not convinced working at the site is safe for anyone and they fear foreign workers will feel ‘pressured’ to ignore risks if jobs are at risk
  • Towns and villages around the plant are still out of bounds because radiation levels are dangerously high
Tokyo Electric Power Co (TEPCO) has announced it will take advantage of the government’s new working visa scheme, which was introduced on April 1 and permits thousands of foreign workers to come to Japan to meet soaring demand for labourers. The company has informed subcontractors overseas nationals will be eligible to work cleaning up the site and providing food services.

...

Activists are far from convinced working at the site is safe for anyone and they fear foreign workers will feel “pressured” to ignore the risks if their jobs are at risk.

“We are strongly opposed to the plan because we have already seen that workers at the plant are being exposed to high levels of radiation and there have been numerous breaches of labour standards regulations,” said Hajime Matsukubo, secretary general of the Tokyo-based Citizens’ Nuclear Information Centre. “Conditions for foreign workers at many companies across Japan are already bad but it will almost certainly be worse if they are required to work decontaminating a nuclear accident site.”

Companies are desperately short of labourers, in part because of the construction work connected to Tokyo hosting the 2020 Olympic Games, while TEPCO is further hampered because any worker who has been exposed to 50 millisieverts of radiation in a single year or 100 millisieverts over five years is not permitted to remain at the plant. Those limits mean the company must find labourers from a shrinking pool.
https://www.scmp.com/news/asia/east-asi ... -fukushima

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ed
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by ed » Sat Oct 19, 2019 11:14 pm

Why not shoot the shit into the sun?
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sparks
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by sparks » Sun Oct 20, 2019 12:14 am

Too expensive. (You're the only one I know who could possibly afford that shit... :) )
You can lead them to knowledge, but you can't make them think.

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robinson
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by robinson » Tue Oct 22, 2019 2:13 pm

The awful question, which almost nobody wants to ask, much less digest an answer to, is "how long does a spent fuel rod (or melted spent fuel) stay hot and dangerous?"

The dangerous part is easy. At least 10,000 years.

The "hot", as in physical heat, is another story.
You never know what's going to happen, then some shit happens nobody saw coming, then later somebody says they knew it was coming, then some new shit happens nobody saw coming, rinse and repeat

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robinson
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by robinson » Tue Oct 22, 2019 2:14 pm

Dangerous means if you are close to it, you will get sick and die. If you are really close to it this will happen in minutes.

If just a tiny tiny bit of it gets inside you, you will also die sooner than expected.
You never know what's going to happen, then some shit happens nobody saw coming, then later somebody says they knew it was coming, then some new shit happens nobody saw coming, rinse and repeat

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robinson
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by robinson » Tue Oct 22, 2019 2:20 pm

The reason spent fuel rods stay hot is that after they have been active, they are full of dangerous fission by-products. So spontaneous fission happens in fuel rods from fuel and fission products. These spontaneous fissions are what keep the fuel rods hot even when they are n longer used in a reactor.

Like the fuel melted under Chernobyl, or in the walls of Three Mile Island, the material at Fukushima is hot and dangerous for at least 10,000 years.
You never know what's going to happen, then some shit happens nobody saw coming, then later somebody says they knew it was coming, then some new shit happens nobody saw coming, rinse and repeat

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sparks
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by sparks » Tue Oct 22, 2019 3:08 pm

First.
You can lead them to knowledge, but you can't make them think.

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ed
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Re: Fukushima one year on

Post by ed » Tue Oct 22, 2019 3:17 pm

Build a honkin big cofferdam around the whole thing and fill it with concrete. Concrete with small amounts of lead in suspension.

Then build a mall on top of the resulting pylon.

Call it The Glowworm Mall

Fixed.

My bill is in the mail.
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