## Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

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Witness
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

Perhaps you'll be interested by this vid: a dude with his own electron microscope ( ) looks at LPs, CDs, and more:

robinson
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

♪ ♫ ♩ ♬ "

"Science and Mother Nature are in a marriage where Science is always surprised to come home and find Mother Nature blowing the neighbor."

♪ ♫ ♩ ♬

Rob Lister
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

I do not understand the graphs.

Witness
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

Abdul Alhazred wrote:How about HD LPs with a laser needle? Really no friction.

And somehow make it digital.

What a great idea!
There's a small article on Wikipedia.
A laser turntable (or optical turntable) is a phonograph that plays LP records (and other gramophone records) usually made of heat-stamped vinyl by using laser beams as the pickup instead of using a stylus as in conventional turntables.
Here the machine of the IRENE project (http://irene.lbl.gov/ – lots of PDFs at the link):

Using methods derived from our work on instrumentation for particle physics we have investigated the problem of audio reconstruction from mechanical recordings. The idea was to acquire digital maps of the surface of the media, without contact, and then apply image analysis methods to recover the audio data and reduce noise.
[…]
Currently the research centers around two efforts. IRENE (top image above) is a scanning machine for disc records which images with microphotography in two dimensions (2D). It is under evaluation at the Library of Congress. For cylinder media, with vertical cut groove, and to obtain more detailed measurements of discs, a three dimensional (3D) scanner is under development (bottom image). I it is planned to begin evaluating this device at the Library of Congress in 2009.

In late 2007 and early 2008 we were involved in a project to restore the earliest sound recording in history. This was a “phonautograph” paper recording due to French inventor Edouard-Leon Scott de Martinville.
From many years ago I also remember work done at the EPFL in Switzerland to read LPs with a rounded glass fiber, which read the upper parts of the track, not degraded by the usual stylus. Alas, found no link to that.

Witness
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

After 30 Years, Sony Starts Manufacturing Vinyl Records Again

Proving once again that vinyl records are far from dead, Sony has re-opened a plant in Tokyo.

Sony has announced that it will once again start manufacturing vinyl records. Per the Agence France–Press, the company will start production in Tokyo. Though the company didn’t specify what genres it will produce, records will reportedly include classic and popular Japanese songs.

Sony’s move to manufacture vinyl records comes thirty years after it stopped making them to focus on CDs. In a factory southwest of Tokyo, Sony has installed record-cutting equipment. The company has also enlisted the help of experienced vinyl engineers to reproduce high-quality sound.

In recent years, record sales have enjoyed steady growth. Earlier this year, British industry group BPI found that 2016 vinyl sales reached pre-1991 levels. In the UK alone, sales have skyrocketed 53%, bringing the total to 3.2 million units.

Here in the US, a similar surge has occurred. BuzzAngle Music found that vinyl record sales gained an impressive 25.9%, moving 7.2 million units in 2016. 17.2 million units were shipped that year. Separately, an exclusive report shared with Digital Music News showed that vinyl sales will reach the $800-900 million mark. It will also surpass$1 billion very soon.
https://www.digitalmusicnews.com/2017/0 ... l-records/

Witness
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

Vinyl Is Poised to Outsell CDs For the First Time Since 1986

In the near future, the revenue generated by record sales is likely to surpass the revenue generated by CDs

Sales of vinyl records have enjoyed constant growth in recent years. At the same time, CD sales are in a nosedive. Last year, the Recording Industry Association of America’s (RIAA) mid-year report suggested that CD sales were declining three times as fast as vinyl sales were growing. In February, the RIAA reported that vinyl sales accounted for more than a third of the revenue coming from physical releases.

This trend continues in RIAA’s 2019 mid-year report, which came out on Thursday. Vinyl records earned $224.1 million (on 8.6 million units) in the first half of 2019, closing in on the$247.9 million (on 18.6 million units) generated by CD sales. Vinyl revenue grew by 12.8% in the second half of 2018 and 12.9% in the first six months of 2019, while the revenue from CDs barely budged. If these trends hold, records will soon be generating more money than compact discs.
https://www.rollingstone.com/music/musi ... aa-880959/

Abdul Alhazred
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

Because CDs are obsolescent if not quite obsolete, whereas vinyl is a successful niche market.

Give CDs 20 years. You'll see.
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Anaxagoras
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

Witness wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 12:35 am
Vinyl Is Poised to Outsell CDs For the First Time Since 1986

... CD sales were declining three times as fast as vinyl sales were growing ...[/url]
I figured that's what's happening. Vinyl is making a comeback, but it's still a niche. Whereas CDs are mostly obsolete and have been for a while.
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare

robinson
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

old vinyl still works with no power

it's like the difference between owning a book and having a ebook on a device
♪ ♫ ♩ ♬ "

"Science and Mother Nature are in a marriage where Science is always surprised to come home and find Mother Nature blowing the neighbor."

♪ ♫ ♩ ♬

Abdul Alhazred
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

robinson wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:03 am
old vinyl still works with no power

it's like the difference between owning a book and having a ebook on a device
Are you talking about a Victrola? That's shellac not vinyl.
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People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

Rob Lister
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

robinson wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:03 am
old vinyl still works with no power

If you happen to have an old wind-up victrola converted to 33.3. I'm not sure that qualifies as 'works'

Abdul Alhazred
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

You would destroy the record quickly.

You need the diamond needle (or smilar) and an amp to play vinyl properly.
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

robinson
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

Nope. The old hand wound non electric players still work, and they don't destroy the record.
♪ ♫ ♩ ♬ "

"Science and Mother Nature are in a marriage where Science is always surprised to come home and find Mother Nature blowing the neighbor."

♪ ♫ ♩ ♬

robinson
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

Hell, the records were designed to work with out electricity.

Last edited by robinson on Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
♪ ♫ ♩ ♬ "

"Science and Mother Nature are in a marriage where Science is always surprised to come home and find Mother Nature blowing the neighbor."

♪ ♫ ♩ ♬

Abdul Alhazred
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

robinson wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:20 am
Nope. The old hand wound non electric players still work, and they don't destroy the record.
Wth LPs?

Picture?
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

robinson
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

Not vinyl

vinyl is the devils work
♪ ♫ ♩ ♬ "

"Science and Mother Nature are in a marriage where Science is always surprised to come home and find Mother Nature blowing the neighbor."

♪ ♫ ♩ ♬

Abdul Alhazred
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

I once played a "78" with my fingernail (turntable was an up to date record player circa 1965).

Too quiet for comfortable listening even when amplified by a conical Dixie cup, but it did work.

I was a smart little kid.

The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

gnome
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

So I heard mention of a "laser phonograph". What kind of results do you get? Does it sound the same as one with a physical needle? Does it actually preserve the record better? Is it stupidly expensive for no real improvement? Or is it affordable?
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Abdul Alhazred
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

A CD player is a "laser phonograph". At least that's the joke I was trying to make, but apparently such a thing for vinyl really exists.

My guess is the market for such a thing are people or organizations copying to digital media one last time.

I'm guessing the sort of person who is "into vinyl" considers it not authentic.

As it might be a steam locomotive that burns diesel to run a steam turbine.
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

Witness
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### Re: Is Neil Young right about sound quality?

Abdul Alhazred wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:14 am
My guess is the market for such a thing are people or organizations copying to digital media one last time.

I'm guessing the sort of person who is "into vinyl" considers it not authentic.
Wrong, because it is (* drumroll *):
"Uncompressed, Non-Digitized, Pure Analog Audio & No Physical Contact"

Because of No Contact, We are Presenting You New Analog Music with No Digitization
http://www.elpj.com/

Pure analog!