## Black Panther

Drama queens must check their tiaras at the door.
Nyarlathotep
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### Black Panther

I liked it but not as much as I thought I would. Lots of great action and characters, but a lot of things straight out of the cliche factory.

At one point, someone says "Where is your god now?" unironically. And, without going into too much spoilery detail, a great deal of the plot was driven by the "Inigo Montoya" factor (somebody killed somebody's dad and they are kind of sore about it).

It could have been a great movie. An interesting take on superheroics with a very different superhero. But the weight of the cliches dragged it down to merely a "good" movie. I'll take good over bad, but I am a little let down that it never lived up to its potential.
The Luggage said nothing, but louder this time.

Grammatron
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Location: Los Angeles, CA

### Re: Black Panther

Another play-it-safe movie from the Disney empire

Nyarlathotep
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Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:50 pm

### Re: Black Panther

Yeah, play-it-safe sounds about right
The Luggage said nothing, but louder this time.

Abdul Alhazred
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Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago

### Re: Black Panther

Any comment on the political hype?

My take is it's just a ploy to drum up publicity.
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

Nyarlathotep
Posts: 48767
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:50 pm

### Re: Black Panther

Meh. If anything it's kind of a righty movie. The major villain is a BLM type who wants to steal high tech to start a revolution. But its not really a political movie, it's really is just a big dumb action movie. Batman with a cat motif instead of a flying rodent and a whole country instead of just a stately manor with a cave on the premises. The villain could have been anyone, really. Though I appreciate that the villain did more than just stand around and look menacing, which has been an issue in Marvel movies of late.

The political ramification I wonder about is whether SJWs willl have a fit in October when little white kids put on a Black Panther mask for Halloween. Not paint their faces black mind you, just wear the costume. I could see that going either way and I am curious how it actually will go.
The Luggage said nothing, but louder this time.

Anaxagoras
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Location: Yokohama/Tokyo, Japan

### Re: Black Panther

Haven't seen it yet myself, but I have started watching Black Lightning on Netflix. Other than the black thing and the superhero thing, pretty different I think. Black Lightning is a high school principal in a rough urban neighborhood in America, not the king of a mythical African country.
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare

gnome
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Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 12:40 am
Location: New Port Richey, FL

### Re: Black Panther

I'd give it a few extra points for one thing-- noting the biggest narrative problem with the existence of Wakanda as an advanced, enlightened society in Africa--and not just handwaving it, but diving right in to the issue and making it a major plot point of the movie.

Looked at that way, I ovserved the major antagonist was driven by more significant motivations than just revenge, even though that did come up in dialog.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

Abdul Alhazred
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Location: Chicago

### Re: Black Panther

Let's see.

A technologically advanced civilization whose political system is trial by combat. Sure.

I think it's a white supremacist plot to make black people look stupid.
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

gnome
Posts: 22876
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 12:40 am
Location: New Port Richey, FL

### Re: Black Panther

I didn't go there, as it's a common enough scifi/comic trope.

More along the lines of their isolationism being not so admirable.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

Anaxagoras
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Location: Yokohama/Tokyo, Japan

### Re: Black Panther

Abdul Alhazred wrote:Let's see.

A technologically advanced civilization whose political system is trial by combat. Sure.

I think it's a white supremacist plot to make black people look stupid.
Like the Klingons! Maybe.
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare

Abdul Alhazred
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Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago

### Re: Black Panther

gnome wrote:I didn't go there, as it's a common enough scifi/comic trope.
I know that, but how is it being sold to black people (rather than comic book geeks)?
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

Nyarlathotep
Posts: 48767
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:50 pm

### Re: Black Panther

The "Trial by combat" thing is one of the many, many cliches I was talking about. Also, from the reactions of the characters in the movie, I got the impression that it was kind of a surprise that someone actually took up the challenge. Kind of like if the apocryphal story of the Oxford student who found the obscure law that test givers were supposed to provide "cakes and ale" so actually asked for it (Then was fined for failure to wear his sword to class) were actually true.

As for how it is "being sold to black people", I haven't seen any complaints about it, either on line or IRL. That's all I can say about it. The biggest reaction I have seen to it is how it is the first big introduction to the masses of an otherwise obscure sub-genre of sci-fi called "afrofuturism", which is a blending of traditional African motifs with sci-fi tropes. And I do have to admit that it made for a sci-fi/fantasy story that was a bit different in look and tone, so it was a good intro.
The Luggage said nothing, but louder this time.

Nyarlathotep
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Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:50 pm

### Re: Black Panther

And yeah, the real takeaway, the theme I think it was supposed to be getting across was the dilemma of keeping their isolation from the world and letting it go to hell around them or possibly helping the rest of the world and having some of the rest of the world's problems come to them.
The Luggage said nothing, but louder this time.

gnome
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Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 12:40 am
Location: New Port Richey, FL

### Re: Black Panther

One thing I was curious of was about all the different tribal art, costumes, and dance. Was it borrowed from actual African culture and art? Was it borrowed respectfully? I would hope so, even as I admit not being certain what it would take to be considered that. But just from the sheer volume of it, I think they would be remiss if it wasn't based on significant research. That's an awful lot to make up from half-formed memories of National Geographic magazines or something.

As far as "marketing to black people"... I think there were some half-hearted efforts to invest a significance into it being a major movie with an African hero, but that wasn't really done even as much as the female thing was done for "Wonder Woman" marketing. So maybe their "marketing plan" to black people was mostly the same as to anyone: leverage the MCU track record and make people expect a good movie that they want to see.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

Nyarlathotep
Posts: 48767
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:50 pm

### Re: Black Panther

Well, I went to a showing on opening day and I noticed a good third of a moderately packed house was African-American despite the fact that I am pretty sure our two-horse town has a grand total of 12 black people in it (not an actual statistic but Carson City is really really white and most of the rest is Hispanic is my point). So even if it isn’t being marketed as such, it’s doing a good job of being noticed by that demographic
The Luggage said nothing, but louder this time.

Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 76833
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago

### Re: Black Panther

I'm wondering how it's doing in towns with a sizable black population.

Chicago, for example.
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

Nyarlathotep
Posts: 48767
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:50 pm

The movie grossed $235 Million over the weekend. Which is a record for a February opening and would be considered a hit in any month and that gives it the second biggest opening of any Marvel movie to date (behind only the first Avengers movie), so it seems to be doing well all over. The Luggage said nothing, but louder this time. Witness Posts: 21903 Joined: Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:50 pm ### Re: Black Panther Abdul Alhazred Posts: 76833 Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm Title: Yes, that one. Location: Chicago ### Re: Black Panther Nyarlathotep wrote:The movie grossed$235 Million over the weekend. Which is a record for a February opening and would be considered a hit in any month and that gives it the second biggest opening of any Marvel movie to date (behind only the first Avengers movie), so it seems to be doing well all over.
Wowed 'em in Pakistan.

https://blogs.tribune.com.pk/story/6406 ... ever-seen/
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 76833
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago

### Re: Black Panther

Forget anything snarky I said.

This movie can't be all bad if it provokes this level of hyperventilation.

http://takimag.com/article/wakanda_bloc ... iler/print#
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.