Electric truck

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ed
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Re: Electric truck

Post by ed »

Rob Lister wrote:
gnome wrote:Battery swap stations? No charging delay, just give the "station" the old battery, grab a freshly charged one (or have a robot replace it unless there's a union issue). Pay the fee which is part energy cost and partly battery replacement costs when they are retired by the stations because they're getting a little dodgy.
Yep. Now think of the logistics. How pretty are they? In the end is it cheaper than diesel?
Think of the logistics involved with fedex before it worked. Woulda been thought impossible ...

" but but there is diesel USPS and UPS. Think of the children"
About that stereo

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Abdul Alhazred
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Abdul Alhazred »

I want Doctor No Face back already. :evil:
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Rob Lister
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister »

ed wrote:
gnome wrote:Battery swap stations? No charging delay, just give the "station" the old battery, grab a freshly charged one (or have a robot replace it unless there's a union issue). Pay the fee which is part energy cost and partly battery replacement costs when they are retired by the stations because they're getting a little dodgy.
Thank you. Please explain the concept to Rob. Use small words and lots of gestures.
Please don't use racist gestures like ed likes.

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Rob Lister
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister »

Better never than late but here it is anyway.

Image
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2018/03/fi ... batteries/

Notable quote
The Semi has ambitious specs that haven't been vetted in the real world yet—Musk promised that the top-line trucks would have a 500-mile range and an 80,000lb maximum load.
Of which only 40,000lb is usable after subtracting the 40,000lb weight of the battery pack. And let's not point out the energy costs of hauling that 40,000lb' battery pack around.

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sparks
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Re: Electric truck

Post by sparks »

Charged battery energy density is nowhere near diesel energy density. The recharge energy has to come from somewhere.

Whole concept is a fucking snipe hunt. Makes no sense at all. Burn some diesel here or some coal over there. Either way, you're fucked.
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Rob Lister
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister »

sparks wrote:Charged battery energy density is nowhere near diesel energy density. The recharge energy has to come from somewhere.

Whole concept is a fucking snipe hunt. Makes no sense at all. Burn some diesel here or some coal over there. Either way, you're fucked.
Not a great argument. The chain of efficiency between the two systems is fairly equal with electric just eking ahead. The energy to that electric solution may be from any number of sources, most of which are much cleaner than diesel or gasoline, with the worst of which--coal--being roughly equal.

Electric cars can be a smart solution.
Electric semis not so much as it has a reverse economy of scale.

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Abdul Alhazred
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Abdul Alhazred »

Besides, the trucks are a fire hazard.

Just like that automated train NYC used to have that kept catching fire while no one was looking.
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sparks
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Re: Electric truck

Post by sparks »

Rob Lister wrote:
sparks wrote:Charged battery energy density is nowhere near diesel energy density. The recharge energy has to come from somewhere.

Whole concept is a fucking snipe hunt. Makes no sense at all. Burn some diesel here or some coal over there. Either way, you're fucked.
Not a great argument. The chain of efficiency between the two systems is fairly equal with electric just eking ahead. The energy to that electric solution may be from any number of sources, most of which are much cleaner than diesel or gasoline, with the worst of which--coal--being roughly equal.

Electric cars can be a smart solution.
Electric semis not so much as it has a reverse economy of scale.
Evidences on the comparison of efficiency?

Agreed that infernal combustion engines driving wheels through a transmission is horribly inefficient. But one wonders how efficient, as pointed out earlier in the thread, it is to haul around 40,000 pounds of batteries. That is one heavy fucking fuel tank.

Let's ignore the 500 mile range claim for the moment.
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Rob Lister
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister »

sparks wrote:
Rob Lister wrote:
sparks wrote:Charged battery energy density is nowhere near diesel energy density. The recharge energy has to come from somewhere.

Whole concept is a fucking snipe hunt. Makes no sense at all. Burn some diesel here or some coal over there. Either way, you're fucked.
Not a great argument. The chain of efficiency between the two systems is fairly equal with electric just eking ahead. The energy to that electric solution may be from any number of sources, most of which are much cleaner than diesel or gasoline, with the worst of which--coal--being roughly equal.

Electric cars can be a smart solution.
Electric semis not so much as it has a reverse economy of scale.
Evidences on the comparison of efficiency?

Agreed that infernal combustion engines driving wheels through a transmission is horribly inefficient. But one wonders how efficient, as pointed out earlier in the thread, it is to haul around 40,000 pounds of batteries.
Yea, that was me. And whereas mine was a valid argument against the use of electric for trucks, yours is not a valid argument against the use of electric in general; either that or it's a very nice snipe worth hunting.

You can find general baselines for ERI's here
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 1513003856

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sparks
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Re: Electric truck

Post by sparks »

"yours is not a valid argument against the use of electric in general;"

Sorry about the misunderstanding: My argument wasn't meant to be against the use of electric in general.

We are on the same page here.
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Rob Lister
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister »

The scam continues. The entire company exists only on paper. I mean, I gotta hand it to them, they know how to sell air.
A Truck Maker With Zero Revenue Scores $7.6 Billion Return for Early Backers

It may have zero revenue, but Nikola Corp.’s stock surge has rewarded a few early believers with 10-figure gains on paper.

Six investors have positions in the truck maker totaling $8.3 billion after investing about $650 million combined, according to an analysis of filings by the Bloomberg Billionaires Index. They include the Agnelli family’s CNH Industrial NV, with a $1.6 billion holding; $1.3 billion for Jeff Ubben’s ValueAct Capital Management, and $1.4 billion controlled by South Korea’s Hanwha Group.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... ly-backers

a-fucking-mazing.
The value of these stakes has fluctuated wildly since Nikola’s reverse merger earlier this month with VectoIQ Acquisition Corp., and skeptics have questioned whether the company will sustain its lofty market value. Short-seller Andrew Left of Citron Research predicted Nikola shares, which climbed as high as $93.99 last week, would fall to $40 in a month. The stock rose as much as 8% before the start of regular trading Wednesday after closing at $62.93 Tuesday.

“I wouldn’t be surprised if they never get a truck on the road,” Left said.
They have $10 Billion in pre-orders. It cost $0 to pre-order.

solely
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Re: Electric truck

Post by solely »

LOL!

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robinson
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Re: Electric truck

Post by robinson »

oh really?

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Rob Lister
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister »

I like it lots. I probably wouldn't like the stupidly unnecessary engineering overkill that Musk can't seem to resist (complex computer-controlled servo-driven door latches in place of two metal rods and a bushing, etc.)

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robinson
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Re: Electric truck

Post by robinson »

Rob Lister wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 1:14 pm
I like it lots. I probably wouldn't like the stupidly unnecessary engineering overkill that Musk can't seem to resist (complex computer-controlled servo-driven door latches in place of two metal rods and a bushing, etc.)
When you learn the pressurized cabin version is going to be the work vehicle on the moon and Mars, it makes more sense.
oh really?

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robinson
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Re: Electric truck

Post by robinson »

These are not the sort of vehicles that are expected to work in a technological vacuum, but they are expected to work in an actual vacuum
oh really?