Poker term question

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gnome
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Poker term question

Post by gnome » Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:50 pm

Is there a name for the betting strategy where you have a strong hand and you draw out bets in rounds, instead of betting high and risking everyone folding?
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Anaxagoras
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Re: Poker term question

Post by Anaxagoras » Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:39 pm

If you google poker betting strategy you can find some information about how much to bet but I don't know if there's a word you're looking for. Basically it's not betting too high or too low.

http://www.firsttimepokerplayer.com/how ... ing-guide/
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
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Abdul Alhazred
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Re: Poker term question

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:54 pm

Oh yes.

Bluffing Waukegan style. Of course. :coolspecs:
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Re: Poker term question

Post by WildCat » Mon Oct 14, 2019 12:25 pm

gnome wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:50 pm
Is there a name for the betting strategy where you have a strong hand and you draw out bets in rounds, instead of betting high and risking everyone folding?
Sandbagging.
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

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Re: Poker term question

Post by ed » Mon Oct 14, 2019 1:06 pm

Teabagging
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Abdul Alhazred
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Re: Poker term question

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Mon Oct 14, 2019 1:22 pm

Not invented by Jack Benny, though he popularized both the strategy and the term for it. 8)

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Re: Poker term question

Post by Anaxagoras » Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:34 am

WildCat wrote:
Mon Oct 14, 2019 12:25 pm
gnome wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:50 pm
Is there a name for the betting strategy where you have a strong hand and you draw out bets in rounds, instead of betting high and risking everyone folding?
Sandbagging.
Ah, yes. That's the word. AKA "slow play" or "trapping".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slow_play_(poker)

And this is why the strategy can backfire if it's too predictable:
Relationship between slow playing and bluffing

Against observant opponents, the frequency of bluffing affects the effectiveness of slow playing, and vice versa. If a player's table image is that of an aggressive bluffer, slow playing is less important because his opponents will be more willing to call his usual bets and raises. Similarly, if a player is perceived as a "trappy" player (uses frequent slow plays), his bluffs are less likely to be respected (i.e., more likely to be called) because his opponents expect him to slow play his strong hands.[2]
If an opponent can figure out your tendencies it could clue them in on how strong your hand is.
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
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Re: Poker term question

Post by gnome » Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:48 am

I needed the term for a metaphor, so not to worry
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

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Re: Poker term question

Post by Rob Lister » Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:06 am

Anaxagoras wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:34 am
WildCat wrote:
Mon Oct 14, 2019 12:25 pm
gnome wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:50 pm
Is there a name for the betting strategy where you have a strong hand and you draw out bets in rounds, instead of betting high and risking everyone folding?
Sandbagging.
Ah, yes. That's the word. AKA "slow play" or "trapping".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slow_play_(poker)

And this is why the strategy can backfire if it's too predictable:
Relationship between slow playing and bluffing

Against observant opponents, the frequency of bluffing affects the effectiveness of slow playing, and vice versa. If a player's table image is that of an aggressive bluffer, slow playing is less important because his opponents will be more willing to call his usual bets and raises. Similarly, if a player is perceived as a "trappy" player (uses frequent slow plays), his bluffs are less likely to be respected (i.e., more likely to be called) because his opponents expect him to slow play his strong hands.[2]
If an opponent can figure out your tendencies it could clue them in on how strong your hand is.
Another way it can backfire is if you check the nuts. At the pro table that can get you penalized and/or fined the pot.

PIck-up at 1:25. Popel gets a nut flush on the river. Jouhk checks and Popel checks behind him. I don't think he realized he had a flush, much less the nut flush. He gets a one-orbit penalty.


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Re: Poker term question

Post by gnome » Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:26 pm

What is "checking the nuts" and why is it a penalized move?
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

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Re: Poker term question

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:29 pm

gnome wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:26 pm
What is "checking the nuts" and why is it a penalized move?
Same reason as in boxing. 8)
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

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Re: Poker term question

Post by Rob Lister » Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:29 pm

Nuts means the hand can't lose. Popel's hole cards were Ace and 9 of hearts. He drew a flush on the river, giving him Ace-high flush. Given the cards showing, there was no possible hand that could beat that. He must bet the hand. And had the other guy bet, Popel would have to raise him if he wasn't all in with a call.

The rule is in place to prevent collusion between players. I personally think it is a dumb rule.

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Re: Poker term question

Post by gnome » Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:49 pm

I'm with you that it sounds dumb--how does it enable collusion?
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

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Re: Poker term question

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 15, 2019 4:32 pm

gnome wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:48 am
I needed the term for a metaphor, so not to worry
gnome (later) wrote: Talking to that guy was playing poker with Jack Benny.
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

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Re: Poker term question

Post by Rob Lister » Tue Oct 15, 2019 4:36 pm

This explains in fewer words than I'd use, and probably even correctly!
Player A and Player C are working in tandem.
The turn comes and gives player C (acting last) the nut flush, obviously unbeknownst to his/her partner.
Players A, B and C remain in the round.
Player A lays down a relatively large bet with two-pair and Player B folds.
Player C calls.
The river comes, Player A checks followed by a check from Player C.

Player A and Player C have no reason to bet against each other on the final round because neither wants to kick the other out of the tournament. There can be many scenarios where if people have arranged beforehand to work together, that checking or flat-calling a nut hand would work to their benefit.
https://www.australiangambling.lv/onlin ... -the-nuts/

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Re: Poker term question

Post by gnome » Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:25 pm

I think I get it. But couldn't you do that just as well with a very strong hand that wasn't necessarily a "nut hand"? Cutting off one rarified instance wouldn't seem to really stop it.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

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Abdul Alhazred
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Re: Poker term question

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:52 pm

gnome wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:25 pm
I think I get it. But couldn't you do that just as well with a very strong hand that wasn't necessarily a "nut hand"? Cutting off one rarified instance wouldn't seem to really stop it.
That's pretty much what Jack said to Fred Allen. 8)
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
The arc of the moral universe bends towards chaos.
People who believe God or History are on their side provide the chaos.

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Re: Poker term question

Post by Rob Lister » Tue Oct 15, 2019 11:02 pm

gnome wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:25 pm
I think I get it. But couldn't you do that just as well with a very strong hand that wasn't necessarily a "nut hand"? Cutting off one rarified instance wouldn't seem to really stop it.
I agree. It's dumb.